If my comment created the appearance that I want you (or others) to shut up, then that is unfortunate and I apologize. Of course information is good, shipping on time is good, sticking to schedules is good.
That said, I find it extremely important to realise how hard and exhausting the process of development and shipping is for creators, and how little delays matter in the context of real life.
At the same time, the retro computing world is richer than ever: arm devices have given us incredibly powerful (and cheap!) toys and we can even get stuff like oled and eink displays that were pure sci-fi 20 years ago. So it doesnāt all hinge on this device.
So my plea is: take a step back and consider the wider context. We are fortunate someone took the challenge to attempt and build such an - admittedly utopian - device. If it ever comes to fruition, that would be a dream come true. But it cannot be that our happiness, and the sanity of the creators, rests on a couple of days.
Whoa now. Coming from someone that made several threads in preparation to the devterm, not accounting how active you are in these parts about it, is it really necessary to attack the @yong like that? Expressing disappointment, sure, but no need to act like THAT.
Thing is, and Iām sure you obviously notice, thereās alot of people pre-ordering the Devterm, not just you or me. Relax! I bought myself the A-series too, have my 18650 preordered, have a mouse ready for me to plug into the devterm, and as giddy as you are for the product coming to me at my doorstep. So the devterm of the cm3 variant rolls out first, to the customers that are deserving as much as we do.
The only way I can see this vivid disappointment of yours (actually got angry up to the point of eliciting this spitting on the internet/screen action) could only be valid because:
-You are actually livid about getting short end of your refund (the most probable scenario)
-Your job hinges on this product (prototyping for company? reviews/unbox videos?)
-Your disappointment is immeasurable and your day is ruined
ā¦ Come on. Letās be better than this. Letās wait for others to get them, while we wait patiently for ours to come. @yong and the team only need to send the items in batches, so its either 90% complete (only the compute boards needed) or maybe itās been completed all this time, just the shipment issue (covid).
So I really hope that your part of refunding is a joke to all of us in this thread (hard to imagine since you already prepared for the devtermās coming and whatnot, I appreciated reading your recommendations! Why crash and burn it all now?)
Yes and no. The whole project was more handled by incompetent people. I will not go into detail mainly because Iām not the one who know the most about that specific system and there is a lot to say about it, but the basis is that the people who done it didnāt really know where they were going and tried to chew more than they can.
It is not a matter of company size, time or money, but a matter of skills.
As for the rest, I will ask to calm down. CPi is a small company, they probably have some issues with the A04/A06 but as the rest is ready (plastic and the shared electronic) so as the CM3 is ready and easy to order they will release and send the CM3 pre-order first giving them the time to solve the issue with the A04/A06 whatever the issues are.
Everyone asking for communication about delays just got an update in the last 24 hours. Weāve heard and seen more in the last 6 weeks than we did in the 12 before that. Weāre being communicated with. It may not be as much as you would prefer, but the communication is there.
I wrote a few days ago that I was disappointed that the thirty days when we were specifically told to expect some news had come and passed in silence. For me it was really less about delays (which do not come as a surprise) and more about a failure to follow through. I ordered the DevTerm with the expectation that there would likely be delays, but I had been hoping to at least be kept in the loop about them.
And, well, it would be nice if CPi had made the 30-day window they set for themselves. But the news was only a couple of days late. And after the recent updates I feel reasonably well informed. Iāll be even happier when there is an essentially certain and concrete timeline. But for now, Iām happy enough.
Iām not clear on where some of the strong reactions are coming from, even now that we got the update we were told to expect. Perhaps CPi could have been more open about the July estimate being a bit on the loose and optimistic side, but I think most of us here were assuming that already.
Anyway.
Thanks for the update, CPi. Iām looking forward to hearing more in the next few weeks. Regardless of what the news is, good or badā¦ I just prefer not feeling like I threw my money into a silent void.
I hope my understanding of English language is correct.
Apparently, based on the threads, that the CM version will come (more or less) on time. The A versions will come later (inevitably). But, I am not sure that they will be severely delayed.
Dude kind of did a 180 on us. I feel like up until now heās been super supportive. Either way, heās justified to feel a little frustrated. Iām also waiting on an A series that I ordered in June, with the understanding I would get it the next month.
Luckily Iām not hard up for the money I threw in to the void, and can still sit and wait for my product, because as itās been mentioned before its a luxury, and I already have the tools to accomplish any computing tasks I may need to.
But still the whole point of a luxury product is that we spend money on them to get a premium experience and service. While Iām still excited to receive my Devterm, and have nothing but respect for the clockwork pi team. it would be dishonest of me to not admit that they definitely have been dropping the ball on this one, and the experience has not felt anything close to luxurious.
Also, if its true that he got shorted on the refund, give this man his 80 dollars back! Heās more then entitled to a full refund after all this if he wants out of the waiting game.
If you ordered an experimental, as-yet-unseen product by a small company that already missed its projected deadline (April this year, for those of us who ordered more than 8 months ago) and expect some kind of āpremium experienceā then youāre out of touch with reality IMO.
What was meant upthread by calling this a āluxuryā is that you donāt need it. Itās not an essential item. Itās a fancy experimental toy for people with disposable income.
regardless of price or product, it makes sense for long-term/new supporters of small teams to want to be trusting of said teams. the idea behind that is to keep people investing money/time/care/etc from feeling like they cant rely on them to be forward and clear about what the team expects and what the team wants the supporters to expect.
there are people who will just be upset regardless of circumstance, and demand their āfancy experimental toyā be on their doorstep tomorrow come hell or high water. the people more invested in the device + team itself and their further endeavours are willing to and make efforts to understand why things are going how they are + set realistic expectations. if those people start to feel foolish for taking you at your word theyāre going to tell you, and the hope is that youād listen to them. theyāre the only people actually seeking out and informing people of information that gets doled out in PMs or sporadic forum posts, so that more impatient people dont just scream āscamā and refund en-masse because the info readily accessible to them is outdated by months or just shown not to be true anymore.
heyāre the only people actually seeking out and informing people of information that gets doled out in PMs or sporadic forum posts
No, they arenāt. If I pre-order a product, I shouldnāt have to hunt down forum posts or scour twitter for images to learn why the will-ship-by date is long past without so much as an email. Yes, making a product is complex, which is why we usually pay others for the product instead. I donāt think itās unreasonable to expect some kind of communication from a seller that a product wonāt ship on time, and as far as I can tell Iāve never got a single email from them about the change in plans.
Yeah, I signed up for the mailing list more than a month ago and I havenāt received any communication at all from that. Not even an email confirming my subscription, apparently. Sending information about delays or revised estimates to mailing list subscribers seems like kind of a no-brainer, I would think?
Itās not that much of an imposition to just watch this forum, and get the information that way. But getting emails would be nice, too.
i agree, and iām saying that at the point where people feel they have to put in that kind of effort to keep other people up to date about someone elses product, youāre probably dealing with some really dedicated fans and should be as clear-cut with those people as possible.
Hey guys, Iām Alex, a member of Clockwork Tech. Some of you guys may have had talks with me as Iāve been doing most of the emails.
Iām here to share some details about the DevTerm.
As @yong has mentioned, the DevTerm is very close to be shipped. The first batch will be the CM3, then A06, then A04. The reason that we have to ship in batches is that as some of you guys have noticed, the CM3 is a pre-manufactured core from RaspberryPi, which weāve ordered for a while. The A06 and A04 are customized cores, they are currently on the producing line. According to the manufacturerās schedule, the A06 will be ready soon, so it will be shipped just a few days after the CM3, a couple of weeks tops. The A04 will take a little more time.
The biggest problem we had was the producing of PCB of the mainborad and the core. Briefly, our designs of the PCB have many more layers than usual, so it was surprisingly complex for our manufacturer. But weāve solved the problem.
Also, although the COVID in Canton has been under control, the effect still exists. Our manufacturers had to hold some producing schedule to cooperate with the government, and that has caused some sort of jam when the new orders came like ours.
But thereās good news.
For starter, chip shortage will no longer be one of our main concerns in the short future. Weāve secured our needs, thanks to our dedicated suppliers.
And, thereās no serious technical difficulties any more. During the time of waiting, our R&D guys has been working on optimizing the OS, trying to support the latest Linux mainline kernel.
Those are what I have in hands now. If you want to know anything else, please feel free to email to alex@clockworkpi.com.
I think, just like all of my colleagues think, as a community, there should not be any hidden information, at least when itās about everyoneās intrest. So, Iāll come back to you guys every time that I have new details to share.
You guys have been awesome. Sincerely.
Thank you for the detailed post. I honestly think, that is what most of the community wants. Much more frequent updates regarding that status. I look forward to the finished product. Product delays are understandable and making a custom board is hard.
Hey @yong could you make sure that every member of CPi who have an account on the forum to have a role that clearly mark them as being member of the team?
Iām not saying Alex is not one of them, but it is fairly easy to pretend and no way for me and other forum members to check if someone is really one of the CPi team. It is especially important if that person want to talk for CPi like Alex just did.
